Απαγόρευση των ναζιστικών συμβόλων

[The_Painless]

Αυτό που συζητιέται στο Ευρωκοινοβούλιο-μπουρδέλο με αφορμή τα του... πρίγκηπα. Όχι ότι δεν έχει ξανασυζητηθεί, απλώς τις προηγούμενες ημέρες "άναψε" πάλι η κουβέντα.
Πιστεύετε πως πρέπει να γίνει ή όχι και γιατί;

[Stormrider]

sta gipeda idika prepei an ta apagorefsoun oposdipote.
exei kantantisei poli spastiko .

[BLiTzER]

Pragmatika einai spoudaio provlhma ekei.

[Medusa]

xwris na pairnw 8esh akribws, exw na shmeiwsw oti merika nazisitika symbola parapempoyn se alla nohmata. Kai ennow kyriws to symbolo ths sbastikas, to opoio ferei ena terastio ogko plhroforiwn arxaias kosmo8ewrias.

bebaia, an th blepeis se aspro fonto kai kokkino paxy perigramma, 8ymizei alla pragmata. :?

[Deggial]

Οι απαγορεύσεις δεν οδηγούν πουθενά. Η έλλειψη ελευθερίας της εκφράσεως απλώς θα οδηγήσει σε πιο δεμένες ακροδεξιές μειονότητες.

[The Charon]

na ta apogoteusoun apo pou?
den 3erw , ean kai ta sumbola ths nazi einai polu progenestera kai arxaia apo thn idia.ektos twn allon nomizw pws einai dikaiwma tou ka8enos na ferei oti sumbolo 8elei arkei na mhn propagandizei.sun to gegonos ths enhmerwseis kai ths plhroforoshs.ti 8a ginei dld ? 8a arxisoume na kaime kai emeis biblia kai sumbola opws ta ekaigan kai oi nazi ?

(mhpws prepei na anoi3oume kai to asvits , na kapsoume tous neo nazi ? san polu kwlo sthnoume stous ebraious , den nomizete? )

[The_Painless]

na ta apogoteusoun apo pou?

Γεωγραφικά, ΕΕ. Πρακτικά, να σου επιβάλλεται ποινή αν φέρεις κάποιο τέτοιο σύμβολο φαντάζομαι. Αν έχεις ένα ραφτό στην τσάντα σου π.χ.
Κι εγώ με Deggial συμφωνώ πάντως.

[Gabriel]

profanws oxi. ektos apo anoysio einai eksairetika hlithio.

[Carcass_]

ase pou tsigglaei kai tous fasistes.
Fusika oxi.

[BLiTzER]

Kai ti tha ginei sta ghpeda pou yparxei megalo provlhma? Exei katanthsei spastiko leme.

[Carcass_]

apla tha valoume tous filathlous na se petrovoloun prin thn enarksh kathe agwna.
Thumasai Life Of Brian ?

[BLiTzER]

Oxi. Aytos thymatai th dikh mou?

[jimid]

Akoma na apantisei o youknowwho...

Sovara perimenw na dw ti tha pei...

Egw eimai kata tis apagoreusis giati kati tetoio tha einai katharos fasismos. As min kanoume oti apexthanomaste.

[The Nerd]

Na mhn ta apagoreysoyn, einai too much

[The_Fool]

Από www.timesonline.co.uk (http://www.timesonline.co.uk)


Hindus reclaim their symbol of life
By Ruth Gledhill, Religion Correspondent

January 19, 2005

HINDUS in Britain have started a campaign to "redeem" the swastika from its
Nazi past and reclaim it as the symbol of life and fortune it once was.
The swastika is a 5,000-year-old symbol that has been used for centuries by
Hindus, Buddhists and many other traditions to denote good luck, but because
of the Nazis it has come to symbolise hate, anti-Semitism, violence, death
and murder. The campaign, announced today, comes after members of the
European Parliament called for a Europe-wide ban on the symbol after Prince
Harry wore a swastika armband to a fancy dress party.
Franco Frattini, the European Commissioner for Justice, Freedom and
Security, has said that he is willing to consider the possibility of a ban.
Nazi symbols including the swastika are banned in Germany.
Hindus use the right-facing version of the swastika, meaning "sun", as
jewellery or on doorways and buildings to bring good fortune. This was the
version adopted by the Nazi Party in 1920 at Salzburg.
It is thought that Allied wartime propaganda is responsible for the false
belief that at Hitler's insistence the swastika was later reversed to the
left-facing version, meaning "death" in Hindu mythology.
Ramesh Kallidai, of the Hindu Forum, is planning pro-swastika awareness
workshops for every region of Britain with a large seminar in London. Every
MP is to be lobbied by e-mail and an information booklet will be distributed
to faith communities and others.
Mr Kallidai said: "A symbol we have used for more than 5,000 years is now on
the verge of being banned because of association with the Nazis over which
we had no control.
"Hindus wish to continue to use this symbol as part of their religion, but
they risk being labelled a Nazi or, in the case of a ban, risk breaking the
law. We need to educate people about the historical context of the symbol,
its wrong use by the Nazis and its importance to Hindus".
Hindus often have swastikas displayed around their homes and business
premises or in artwork. Mr Kallidai said that it was ironic that a symbol
depicting the wheel of life and good fortune had become a symbol of racism,
torture and war.
Nitin Mehtma, founder of Young Indian Vegetarians, said: "Hindus were known
as Aryans and the swastika was a symbol which identified them as
peace-loving, cultured, tolerant people. It would be nice if this aspect of
the swastika can be highlighted."
Ashok Chudasama, of the Blackburn Hindu Centre, runs courses to explain the
use of the sign by Hindus. He said: "When people in the north raised
concerns about us using the swastika, we educated them and they have taken
on board the true meaning."
Bhupendra Patel, a magistrate and the secretary of the Shree Sattavis Gam
Patidar Samaj, a Hindu organisation, said: "Like many Christians wear
crosses, many Hindus wear swastikas. Does this mean they will be ostracised
as Nazis?"
A spokesman for the Board of Deputies of British Jews, which has a
well-established dialogue in place with Britain's Hindus, said: "We respect
the Hindu Forum's desire to take back the swastika but it should be
remembered that neo-Nazis and racists when daubing the swastika get it wrong
more than they get it right. It is a sensitive issue and would require
further dialogue."
ANCIENT SIGN OF FORTUNE


One of the oldest known swastikas was painted on a paleolithic cave 10,000
years ago and swastikas have been found on pottery and coins from ancient
India, China and Greece


Swastika is derived from the Sanskrit word svastikah, "being fortunate".
Swastika is made up of two Sanskrit words, "su" meaning good and "asti"
meaning to exist. The last part changes the infinitive to the imperative so
that the literal meaning of the term swastika is "let good prevail"


According to legend, the Buddha left footprints in the shape of swastikas


Native American blankets were woven with swastikas until the 1930s, when
they were abandoned because of the symbol's use by the Nazis


The symbol is formed from the shape of a cross, with the arms bent to the
right symbolising health and life, or to the left, which came to symbolise
ill fortune


The original designer of the Nazi emblem was Dr Freidrich Krohn, a dentist
and a member of several German nationalist groups


The swastika was popularised in Germany after the archaeologist Heinrich
Schliemann found many objects with swastikas on them when directing the
excavation of Troy and Mycenae. He linked the symbol to the Aryan people

[The_Fool]

Πάρτε και μερικά links για περισσότερα πάνω στη σβάστικα.


http://www.swastika-info.com/

http://www.sabon.org/swastika/index.html
(στα γερμανικά)

[Kain]

[zER]Oxi. Aytos thymatai th dikh mou?

psofaw. :lol:


On topic : Hm kai egw ths apopshs pou exoun oi perissoteroi eimai, ( na mhn katargh8oun ka8ws einai fasistiko mpla mpla ) alla apo thn allh isws to blepoun (oi eurwpaioi hgetes) ws esxato meso antimetwpishs ths anerxomenhs akro-deksias,kyriws sthn gallia thn ollandia kai thn germania.

[Raven Lord]

αν τα απαγορεύσουν ως "ναζιστικά" σύμβολα, τότε θα συμβάλλουν ακόμη περισσότερο στην ταύτισή τους με το ναζισμό. καλύτερα να προβάλλουν το τι συμβόλιζαν πριν τα υιοθετήσει ο χίτλερ...

[The Nerd]

αν τα απαγορεύσουν ως "ναζιστικά" σύμβολα, τότε θα συμβάλλον ακόμη περισσότερο στην ταύτισή τους με το ναζισμό. καλύτερα να προβάλλουν το τι συμβόλιζαν πριν τα υιοθετήσει ο χίτλερ...

Vges esy volta me th svastika e3w (to ekane kai o prince Harry ths agglias, einai trendy!) kai e3hghse toys oti DEN eisai nazisths ...

:shock:


[edit]
http://flagspot.net/images/d/de-1933.gif

[Raven Lord]

[quote="Raven Lord":35js5d9w]αν τα απαγορεύσουν ως "ναζιστικά" σύμβολα, τότε θα συμβάλλον ακόμη περισσότερο στην ταύτισή τους με το ναζισμό. καλύτερα να προβάλλουν το τι συμβόλιζαν πριν τα υιοθετήσει ο χίτλερ...

Vges esy volta me th svastika e3w (to ekane kai o prince Harry ths agglias, einai trendy!) kai e3hghse toys oti DEN eisai nazisths ...

[/quote:35js5d9w]

ψιλοάσχετο με αυτό που είπα, όμως...

[Deggial]

[quote="Raven Lord":26gt9ikc]αν τα απαγορεύσουν ως "ναζιστικά" σύμβολα, τότε θα συμβάλλον ακόμη περισσότερο στην ταύτισή τους με το ναζισμό. καλύτερα να προβάλλουν το τι συμβόλιζαν πριν τα υιοθετήσει ο χίτλερ...

Vges esy volta me th svastika e3w (to ekane kai o prince Harry ths agglias, einai trendy!) kai e3hghse toys oti DEN eisai nazisths ...
[/quote:26gt9ikc]

Προφανώς υπάρχει μια κοινή πλέον συνείδηση γύρω απ'την ερμηνεία του συμβόλου, αυτό είναι άσχετο όμως με όσα γράφει ο Raven Lord, ότι το σύμβολο στο παρελθόν είχε άλλη σημασία, την οποία οι περισσότεροι αγνοούν και αυτό θα ενισχυθεί.

[ang69]

Vges esy volta me th svastika e3w (to ekane kai o prince Harry ths agglias, einai trendy!) kai e3hghse toys oti DEN eisai nazisths ...



ΑΝ ΤΟ ΚΑΝΟΥΜΕ ΟΛΟΙ ΘΑ ΚΑΘΙΕΡΩΘΕΙ!

[symposium_lexotanil]

axxaaaaxxaaxax
ase pou se merika meri tou kosmou einai ιδιοματισμός

[Estelle]

Tha 3hlwsoun dhladh kai ta kagkela apo to nomismatiko mouseio sthn Panepisthmiou??? :P

Egw pantws eimai kata ths katarghshs.

O,ti apagoreuetai ginetai automatws pio deleastiko.

[Coroner]

Οι απαγορεύσεις δεν οδηγούν πουθενά. Η έλλειψη ελευθερίας της εκφράσεως απλώς θα οδηγήσει σε πιο δεμένες ακροδεξιές μειονότητες.

Auto. Re pousth mou auto to paidi de me afhnei na grapsw kai tipota diko mou!

Pisteuw pantws oti prepei na apagoreusoume sto nerd na postarei nazistika sumvola :D.

[symposium_lexotanil]

Tha 3hlwsoun dhladh kai ta kagkela apo to nomismatiko mouseio sthn Panepisthmiou??? :P

Egw pantws eimai kata ths katarghshs.

O,ti apagoreuetai ginetai automatws pio deleastiko.

sou apagoreuo na min ksanagrapseis sto er

[NuC]

oxi den prepei na ginei. den ine ton naziston to sima akrivws. egoune gami8ei na 8avoun politismous. na valoun ta 12 asteria ston kwlo tous na goustaroun.

[jimid]

25 pleon.

[NuC]

ime palioimerologitis.

[jimid]

:-o

[blackbird]

Proswpika thewrw exisou apotropaio na xreisimopoieis nazistika symvola yia plaka me to na eisai akrodexios kai na ta fereis anoihta (toulahiston autoi ehoun mia A syneidisi sto ti kanoun de to kanoun yia na poulisoun mouri elpizw na yinomai katanoitos)
Episis eimai kata tis hrisis twn symvolwn yenikotera eite auta einai thriskeutika eite politika yiati stin ousia exypiretoun to fanatismo kai to diahwrismo twn anthrwpwn se antipala stratopeda
Oson afora tin kataryisisi twn na zistikwn symvolwn parauta imo panta teinw pros tin apopsi tou Deggial afou to mono pou mporei na epakolouthisei einai epidinwsei tis katastasis

[eyeamflesch]

Thymamai se mia aptis prwtes takseis tou dimotikou pou kamname gia to mykinaiko politizmo kai eixe mia zwgrafia apo kapoio anaxtoro kai sto artwork twn toixwn eixie kai zbastikies - i kathigitria den iskere nameksigisei yati. Paizei natan aptis prwtes fores pou katalabw oti i eksousia den exei to alathito i tin pantognwsia :)

[Mitsmann]

χαχααχαχαχχαχχα λατρεια ασχετο, αλλα σε φανταστηκα στο δημοτικο με τσαντα δημοτικου βεβαια αλλα με ραστα και μουσια χααχχααχαχχααχ

[Elfstone]

Proswpika thewrw exisou apotropaio na xreisimopoieis nazistika symvola yia plaka me to na eisai akrodexios kai na ta fereis anoihta (toulahiston autoi ehoun mia A syneidisi sto ti kanoun de to kanoun yia na poulisoun mouri elpizw na yinomai katanoitos)
Episis eimai kata tis hrisis twn symvolwn yenikotera eite auta einai thriskeutika eite politika yiati stin ousia exypiretoun to fanatismo kai to diahwrismo twn anthrwpwn se antipala stratopeda

Ti les twra? Dhladh oi akrodeksioi pou xrhsimopoioun ena symvolo diastrevlonontas thn shmasia tou "exoun mia A syneidish" enw kapoios pou kanei plaka stis apokries "poulaei mourh"? De xreiazetai na pairnoume kapoia pragmata pio sovara apoti einai giati ftanoume sthn logikh twn sygrafewn tou "Rock kai Satanismos".
Epishs, den einai h xrhsh twn symvolwn to provlhma alla h paideia autwn pou ta xrhsimopoioun. Se kathe provlhma prepei na vriskoume thn riza tou gia na to katapolemhsoume ki oxi na vriskoume lyseis pou dhmiourgoun nea provlhmata.

[blackbird]

katarhas diavazw kai variemai na trapsw polla
de milisa yia tin arhaigoni simasia tis swastikas alla yia ti hitleriki tin opoia hrisimopoioun oi nazi ara profanws den eyina katanoitos
Episis eipa oti eimai antithetwws me ti hrisi twn symvolwn tetoiou typou yenikotera
An synehizw na mi yinomai katanoitos tha epanelthw molis teleiwsw to kefalaio pou diavazw
cheers

[The Nerd]

katarhas diavazw kai variemai na trapsw polla
de milisa yia tin arhaigoni simasia tis swastikas alla yia ti hitleriki tin opoia hrisimopoioun oi nazi ara profanws den eyina katanoitos
Episis eipa oti eimai antithetwws me ti hrisi twn symvolwn tetoiou typou yenikotera
An synehizw na mi yinomai katanoitos tha epanelthw molis teleiwsw to kefalaio pou diavazw
cheers

Sta polemika otan deixnei nazhdes kleineis thn TV h to vazeis sto fast forward?

[Tonosalata]

:offtopic:
Twra pou eida afta 8umi8ika to prosfato simvan me ton megalo gio ths diana pou se ena party evale stolh nazistikh ktl ktl

[The Nerd]

Re paidia, ofeilete na to paradexteite: To 3o raix STYLISTIKA gamoyse. Amesa anagnwrisimo kai prwtotypo stylaki.

On topic twra: Me kammia logikh den prepei na apagoreyetai kanena symvolo. Shmera oi svastikes kai o sidhroys stayros, ayrio ti?

[NuC]

Re paidia, ofeilete na to paradexteite: To 3o raix STYLISTIKA gamoyse. Amesa anagnwrisimo kai prwtotypo stylaki.

On topic twra: Me kammia logikh den prepei na apagoreyetai kanena symvolo. Shmera oi svastikes kai o sidhroys stayros, ayrio ti?

simfono mazi sou (.....) . gia kapoious ine simvola apla. kai to xa stin tsanta mou sto likio mono kai mono gia na ksinizoun oi knites. se kamia periptwsi
den me endiefere to ti simvolizei. den to proo8ousa. mpistaga na to vlepw.

[The Nerd]

Re paidia, ofeilete na to paradexteite: To 3o raix STYLISTIKA gamoyse. Amesa anagnwrisimo kai prwtotypo stylaki.

On topic twra: Me kammia logikh den prepei na apagoreyetai kanena symvolo. Shmera oi svastikes kai o sidhroys stayros, ayrio ti?

simfono mazi sou (.....) . gia kapoious ine simvola apla. kai to xa stin tsanta mou sto likio mono kai mono gia na ksinizoun oi knites. se kamia periptwsi
den me endiefere to ti simvolizei. den to proo8ousa. mpistaga na to vlepw.

Mia apo ta idia edw, an kai neonazisths, gyrnaga me mployza sfyrodrepano gia na frikarw toys aggloys

[eyeamflesch]

χαχααχαχαχχαχχα λατρεια ασχετο, αλλα σε φανταστηκα στο δημοτικο με τσαντα δημοτικου βεβαια αλλα με ραστα και μουσια χααχχααχαχχααχ

:orse: :D

[UmbilicalResidue]

Re paidia, ofeilete na to paradexteite: To 3o raix STYLISTIKA gamoyse.
true.



parolo pou tis eikastikes texnes tis eixan gamefsei oso de paei.

[enitharmon]

[quote="The Nerd":1r2qbdau]Re paidia, ofeilete na to paradexteite: To 3o raix STYLISTIKA gamoyse. Amesa anagnwrisimo kai prwtotypo stylaki.

On topic twra: Me kammia logikh den prepei na apagoreyetai kanena symvolo. Shmera oi svastikes kai o sidhroys stayros, ayrio ti?

simfono mazi sou (.....) . gia kapoious ine simvola apla. kai to xa stin tsanta mou sto likio mono kai mono gia na ksinizoun oi knites. se kamia periptwsi
den me endiefere to ti simvolizei. den to proo8ousa. mpistaga na to vlepw.

Mia apo ta idia edw, an kai neonazisths, gyrnaga me mployza sfyrodrepano gia na frikarw toys aggloys[/quote:1r2qbdau]
eisai ilithios kai kompleksikos oso den paei e?

[The Nerd]

Esy sthn koyzina soy pisw kai grhgora

:offtopic:

[enitharmon]

ekei eimai oli mera leme

[Deggial]

Αν το PC βρίσκεται στη κουζίνα, πού είναι το πρόβλημα;